What are the odds of getting a decently performing, affordable midsize electric sedan from one of the mainstream manufacturers in the near future?

"KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time" (kngt) 05/21/2020 at 19:54 • Filed to: Electric Vehicles, electric cars, sedans, sedan, I like sedans

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Saab 9-3 based Chinese electric sedan

A used Model 3 will fit the bill, so ignore that. Suppose I wanted a>200HP and about 300 Miles of range sedan around $30K new ? Say an Accord or Mazda6 or a Sonata electric? Disregard the merits/demerits of sedan bodystyle, or that some “sedans” today are actually liftbacks (which I will also include)

Do you think the Hondas and Toyotas of the world will skip this segment all together and focus only only hatchback/crossover styles because sedans and dying dead and what not? I mean at some point everything will end up becoming electrified, partially or fully so do you think there’s a chance?

Right now the only 2 “sedans” (liftbacks) are Honda Clarity electric (crappy 89 mile range, lease only) and Hyundai Ioniq with 170mile range

In the year say 2025, is there a possibility?

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I just like sedans, man.

ranwhenparked > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 19:56

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A sedan? Is anyone even building midsize sedans right now?

I mean, some automakers will again, eventually, but most of them s eemed to be running away from the segment as fast as they could, even before the shutdown.

jimz > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:00

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I kind of doubt it. You might find a sedan from Volvo/Polestar or Audi, but those ain’t going to be “affordable.”

if it’s going to be anyone, it might be Honda or Hyundai/Kia.  Honda isn’t nearly as married to hydrogen as Toyota is, and Hyundai is stubborn enough to ride the sedan train all the way to the ocean floor. 

SBA Thanks You For All The Fish > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:00

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It’s called a Camry Hybrid. Unless you just want a commuter car...

https://www.toyota.com/camryhybrid/

Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:01

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0-2%

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > SBA Thanks You For All The Fish 05/21/2020 at 20:09

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Full electric, not a hybrid. Lots of good ones even right now.

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > Highlander-Datsuns are Forever 05/21/2020 at 20:10

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Highlander-Datsuns are Forever > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:13

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What a great scene.

facw > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:14

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I think the Model 3 and the Ioniq are about as close as you’re going to get there.  

412GTI > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:15

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I just want an Accord Type-R..I guess that would be the new TLX but eh. I’d bet low with getting an electric sedan - just wait till we start seeing more Model Y’s on the street than 3's,

Nauraushaun > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:15

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Euro rules should drive some EV production and I think as long as the Model 3/Y is doing well, manufacturers are going to be trying to get in the space. I think it’s likely. I think it’s inevitable that they will have vehicles in the segment, they’re just behind the times.

Given 5 more years I can’t see that still being true.

That said, I’d have thought the same thing when the i3 came out but that was 7 years ago.

jimz > ranwhenparked 05/21/2020 at 20:17

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The Accord and Camry will exist until the heat death of the universe. Hyundai will probably keep at it for a while even though they’ve got to be losing their asses off on the Sonata.

realistically, sedans are going to stick around. For the foreseeable future, though, only about half of the mainstream car companies will offer one. It’s not that literally  nobody is buying sedans, its that the segment volume is small enough where not everyone can play in it.  The Accord and Camry have always been the 400 lb gorillas in the segment; I think at their peaks they were selling 400-450,000 every year.  but even those two have lost a lot of annual volume.  they’re still clearing 200k+ a year and probably still making money, but not as much as they were about 10 years ago. 

Jb boin > Nauraushaun 05/21/2020 at 20:20

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There are some plug-in hyrid like the 508 or the 3 series that can do around 50km on pure electric power, not sure if there is a real market here for pure electric that would not cost sensibly less and have a worse combined autonomy with most of the daily commutes being under the 50km .

SBA Thanks You For All The Fish > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:23

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Still confused on why you’d put up with the extra cost and hassle relative to a clean PHEV you can take on long trips if you’d like.

Everything’s worse on a pure EV. Unless you only want to commute in it, but the running costs on a Camry, with $2 gas, is under 4 cents a mile. Tesla can’t come close to that all in.

It’s a sincere question. There must be something that drives the desire for an EV beyond cost-and-practicality.

punkgoose17 > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:26

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Wait 7 more years for one to come to market.

dogisbadob > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:34

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The Volt is a mostly electric Rex EV. Do es that count? They stopped making i t last year, but prices on them should be good

Exage03040 @ opposite-lock.com > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:36

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Starting $30k? I kind of doubt it. Maybe towards $40k like what a next gen (or successor to that) Nissan Leaf + or Chevy Bolt could do? I know they’re hatch but I’m looking at this objectively as a tech platform .

Honda, Toyota seem hellbent on Hybrid and PHEV for the next 5 years at least.

Textured Soy Protein > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:37

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Interesting timing you have.

https://jalopnik.com/next-gen-kia-stinger-may-be-one-of-11-new-electric-kias-1843592964/amp

feather-throttle-not-hair > 412GTI 05/21/2020 at 20:39

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Euro-R bruh.  (Just my favorite name)

Nibby > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:39

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keep your eyes out for the new 2021 ford tempo

OPPOsaurus WRX > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:46

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can you even get a regular sedan in that price?

For Sweden > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:51

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What are the odds of getting a decently performing, affordable midsize electric sedan from one of the mainstream manufacturers in the near future?

zero

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > SBA Thanks You For All The Fish 05/21/2020 at 20:52

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What hassle? I can charge at home, never need to go to a gas station. How is “everything” worse in a pure ev? If I’m going the efficient route why not go with Efficiency + instant torque fun. Even a 200hp Kona electric is a hoot to drive from what i’ve seen. And I can live with 300 miles range quite comfortably. If I need aboslute peace of mind i’ll take my wife’s car for longer trips.

Nauraushaun > Jb boin 05/21/2020 at 20:52

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Good point, that’s not such a bad option eh. It’s sort of like the petrol engine is a huge range extender, but 50km is probably enough for most cars most days. Especially if you can charge in between trips.

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > Textured Soy Protein 05/21/2020 at 20:52

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Hmmmmm. I Like the Stinger. Korea to the rescue again!

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > OPPOsaurus WRX 05/21/2020 at 20:54

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Yes you absolutley can. Check the manufacturers sites-Accord Camry etc. , plus sedans sell at a higher discount than their equivalent crososver in the same class.

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > Nibby 05/21/2020 at 20:57

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Yo u got it!

BrianGriffin thinks “reliable” is just a state of mind > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 20:58

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I mean...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_RAV4_EV?wprov=sfti1

Oppo is fairly negative. I think what you’re asking for will exist in less than ten years; likely five. Probably won’t be a sedan, though, in the US; more likely a CRV or RAV4 sized small crossover.  Maybe a lifted hatch like a HRV or GLA sized CUV. 

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > dogisbadob 05/21/2020 at 21:00

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Yeah they stopped it, that's why it didnt come up in the lists I looked at for 2020 models 

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 21:59

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If that Electric Chinese Saab comes in a Sportcombi then I want one real bad. 

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 22:01

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Some what unrelated but I think Nissan should make a small sporty electrical liftback and and call it a Pulsar. 

SiennaMan > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/21/2020 at 22:06

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A gas powered sedan was the place to get the best bang for your buck before the corona.  

interstate366, now In The Industry > feather-throttle-not-hair 05/21/2020 at 23:31

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Which is amusing because it wasn’t sold in Europe, but rather Japan . It was just based on the European Accord Type R.

(I’m sure you knew that but I’m also sure others don’t)

Eury - AFRICA TWIN!!!!!!! > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/22/2020 at 06:54

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Some ridiculous deals exist on used Volts though, and they are a great car. We bought our 2016 last year with 7k miles on it for 16999, and that included a warranty and having the seats reupholstered in leather. Sticker on the car was 32k. 

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time 05/22/2020 at 13:29

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If you weren’t so hung up on the Sedan bit there’s probably a Bolt at a dealership near you that meets pretty much all your requirements.

- 200HP/266lb-ft torques

- 257 mile range

- lease cost on mine (fully loaded, stickers at something over $40k ) after federal/state/manuf. incentives came in at $25k so well below your price point

Bugs me to no end that this thing keeps getting compared at “$44k” against a Tesla at $40k. Tesla doesn’t negotiate so MSRP is what you will always pay. If you’re walking in to a dealership and paying MSRP on a Chevy you need to go see a doctor.